Thursday, May 23, 2013

Relationship with the Eastern Orthodox

Fr. Z had an interesting post on attending the Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom in a Greek Orthodox church if vacationing on a Greek island without a Catholic church (HERE). He encouraged the reader to do so, but make a Spiritual Communion as Orthodox priests cannot give non-Orthodox Communion at all.

I did some research, and found this:
"In brief, while Roman Catholicism sees Orthodoxy as a 'sister church', Orthodoxy sees herself as the fullness of the Church, not the “other half” of the Church, as implied in the notion of a 'sister church.'" 
Wait. Wait. Wait. How does the Catholic Church-and bear in mind that this includes the Eastern Churches- possess an incomplete form of Christianity? What gave Orthodoxy the faith, when St. Peter was recognized by the Church Fathers in East and West as Prince of the Apostles, and who came to Rome? I do not claim that the Orthodox split 'from Rome' and that the papacy is Ultramontanist or even High Petrine. But the Orthodox claim that they want a more Patristic expression on our end. Fine you got it in Benedict and Francis. The former is very Augustinian, the latter low-key.

Then this:
Also, what you say about "one" holy orders is inaccurate. While, at sundry times, Roman Catholic clergy have been received into the Orthodox Church without ordination, this has been more of the exception than the rule, I would say. Until the 17th century in Russia and Ukraine, for example, Roman Catholics converting to Orthodoxy were all baptized. It has been much the same case in the Greek and South Slavic lands. And, while many are Chrismated now (although this pendulum appears to be swinging back to baptism), you will find few cases of receiving non-Orthodox clergy without ordination, certainly not if Chrismation or Baptism is required first. Therefore, those cases of vesting or reception by rejection of errors or Confession are the exceptions. We do not share any of the Holy Sacraments in common. I'm sorry you are misinformed. 
 This is exactly why we might never get over the hump. Certain Orthodox leaders, particularly in Russia as noted, lack humility and can't make concessions. In fact, re-performing the sacrament as they mention here is heresy, and has been since the Patristic era.'s never as simple as this. I can say that in the 16th, 17th, and 18th centuries, often one's Catholicism or confession of Orthodoxy changed depending on the ruler and part of the country. Technically the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church remained united with the Church in Rome, but the priests at times shifted from Orthodoxy to Catholicism back to Orthodoxy. And wait, are you going to make people get married again too, even f a priest witnessed their marriage? Apparently so.

I can't understand why these people can't get over the hump and accept that the Western expression of Christianity changed to the Scholastic model. Change has to occur for things to stay the same.

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